Відео

Download the current version and try the hard chart, it is the original.

I sense there's a strong reaction here, and I'm genuinely interested in understanding. The goal was to blend a bit of light-hearted creativity with some serious themes, using AI as a tool in the process. What are your specific concerns about this approach?

thanks, decent angle. I would say that, of course. I always value thoughtful dialogue, including from those who might be uneasy about using AI in creative processes. Innovation unsettles and stirs strong reactions as it disrupts the status quo and can undermine hardened values of good and bad. Particularly, once momentum over how to respond builds and it's shared and reaffirmed in like-minded groups (this is the internets secret sauce). Reflecting on Skrillex’s rise in 2010 or the complaints around Dragonforce's use of post-processing make the point vividly. Both were met with resistance but then found their place in the music landscape, reshaping it. Something important to take from the internet is that 1% are capable of making 99% of the noise. It's easy to think things are more overblown than they seem.

because being against AI taking artists' purpose away is definitely "weirdo" behavior. its not the same thing as the beginning of the internet, jesus

@@esotericliza there is nothing you can do about it. You and everyone like you are like a human standing on the beach with their arms out trying to push away a tsunami. Being uptight and going “nuh uhh not cool ” just because it’s Ai isn’t going to stop anything. Might as well embrace it and guide people like schmutz who are open to criticism and willing to listen to at least use it right. Something im sure he is intending on doing

I've been obsessed with the trailer. GTA VI will most likely be a timeless classic and standout from the boring games made these days. I don't care what it costs but I pray it isn't over-focused on pushing in game transactions and season passes.

I can tell you’ve thought hard about it. I’m interested if there is much documented on skilled musicians thoughts on generative AI music. I’d love to hear what celebrated virtuosos like Joe Satriani, Buckethead, Stevie ray Vaughan, John Petrucci, Jordan Rudess have to say. I would not be surprised if most of them are experimenting with it. Because I could imagine the thing that motivates them is merely translating their musical ideas into reality and they’ll see this as another tool.

@@schmutz06 i wouldn't imagine them being super in favor of it, since as instrumentalists, _they_ want to express _their own_ feelings, and not delegate that to a third-party (which would be the AI in this case). maybe Jordan Rudess would be receptive from a tech stand point. but obviously, this is just my guess, since that's all we can do outside of asking them directly. plus, most of what i've heard from Suno has been quite bland, composition-wise - common chord progressions, simple melodies (nothing against those tbh). but maybe i should tinker with it myself; what if i prompt it to do more intricate stuff, such as prog metal, jazz fusion and whatnot? would the AI understand music theory terms if i threw them at it? i just wish discussion about the subject wasn't as polarized as it is. both sides have fascinating arguments, if only they had the willingness to hear each other...

@@GoulartGH it’s only a matter of time before we get some real insights from such musicians, so we will see. There are very hardened opinions, but many are well presented, covering many valid angles.

I would like to see the same mob who are frustrated by generative AI help protect artists and get legislation and values aligned. Everything AI does is uncanny valley in my opinion, and I think perhaps others find that more unsettling than I do for some reason. I am intrigued by the thought of using it as a base and adding layers to it. I don’t see the harm.

that’s okay, not every piece resonates with everyone. If you have specific thoughts on what didn’t work for you, I’m open to hearing them.

@@schmutz06 well its mainly the fact that it is AI that just doesnt interest me all of what you're hearing (that the AI made) is most likely stolen from original work, without consent, theres no preventing that with AI music or art. the song also just isnt good at all but its not really your fault here.

​@@esotericliza thank you I appreciate your honesty and the ethical concerns you raised. It opens up complex conversations about creativity and originality. Because like human artists, AI 'learns' from what's been done, but it doesn't 'steal' in a traditional sense, it's programmed to create something new from learned patterns. The training process raises valid questions about attribution which I agree should be addressed. As for my own thoughts, I'm intrigued by AI's potential to amalgamate vast musical knowledge and produce something distinctive, something no single human could have experienced in one lifetime. I see it as a way to augment our own creativity, a collective musical consciousness. My own investment over the years in music has been for love of the art; if AI can help others express ideas without the steep learning curve, I’m excited to see how it might expand the horizons of what we consider possible in music. It’s a shift, and it will take time for the industry and artists to get used to it. This dialogue is what’s needed as we shape the future of music, it must be elevated beyond simple approval or disapproval. I don't believe that auto-writing it off for the reasons you alluded to initially is the right approach. What you hear from AI is more like a window into what someone who has lived a million lifetimes and heard every song would be able to produce. In terms of this song in particular, it is more likely that you are simply not into this genre than the AI (it's rather basic and uninspired musically and the lyrics are rushed, but not 'bad' in the sense of what it is doing). In a twist of fate, it is likely that in the near future you might consume a piece of art that deeply moves you, only to later learn that it was generated by AI. Correct labelling of AI generated content is important to avoid the sense of betrayal.

@@schmutz06 i agree with most of this to an extent, a lot of good points. AI can absolutely be used for good if done right and has a lot of potential.

I’m already working on something with synthesized vocals so yes. In addition, I would love to generate an ambient piece then layer content over the top. I also want to use stem separation tech to take songs like TTFAF and cult of personality and remix them. This all seems exciting to me but I’m mindful how people feel, it’ll be interesting as it unfolds.

Ok

I want to use it to enhance. There is a new function in fl studio which spawns chord progressions, it can build interesting bases for songs. My interpretation of that is that the creative decision making is untouched, it only makes things quicker. Imagination will triumph, creativity will stand out etc etc. Others argue that it undermines people who have studied music theory for years. Everything is a trial and error process for me. I have no training and have never been inclined to learn stuff like sheet music or scales. I don’t think songs like ‘zoidberg the cowboy’ or ‘ge4ce’ come from studying chord progressions and theory or respecting anything about conventional music structure. I think the broken chaotic, still-somehow-works style is just raw personality. I hope these types of insights help explain why I don’t seem bothered by generative AI creating music. I view it as an extension of expression rather than a replacement.

Thanks. I think you process and articulate it better than I can. The kaleidoscope metaphor is a good way to describe my interest. I think many have put their thoughts across very respectfully, even if it seems harsh, I can see that my pro-AI outlook is something that some find disappointing, cheap and upsetting. Yes mindfulness is important and I want to engage with people to get a broader perspective. I follow tech closely and around a year ago I genuinely believed everyone was in awe marvelling at AI, but UA-cam and Twitter are exceptionally good at pairing you with people who think like you. A few conversations (in the real world, not online) slapped me into shape. From there, I’ve been thinking about how to put across my thoughts online and decided to bite the bullet with this. I don’t think it’s an issue for rhythm games but people’s opinions are hot on my mind.

I understand what you are saying, and that many others feel that way. But I want to understand why; is it the threat to artists and the training methods, is it something existential?

That is cool, thank you for commenting. You hold some similar views to mine. I find it striking that I’ve invested much of my life to producing music and that I only view the technology as a turbo charger. If I was left unchecked, the concept that generative AI is some grotesque mockery of what it means to be human wouldn’t have ever naturally entered my mind. I'm really intrigued by that. The legislation around training data is undeveloped and consent should be granted. I don't think an 'AI bad' response is going to do anything to help. The capabilities are advancing and critical feedback and reasoning is needed to produce hardened legislation that will protect future artists work from being undermined by generative AI. I think entirely new values around creative works are going to be needed. At my core, I want to see the principles of hard work, natural ability and innovation protected. The discussion takes me back to when I was in immediate awe of producers like Skrillex, around 2010. Corners of the internet passionately disliked it. All I cared about was how much it sounded like Optimus prime; the musical and I couldn't get enough. In my experience, new technologies always initially go through a phase of resistance before becoming accepted.

I pulled the lever, it did nothing! what now?

i sense there's a story behind that 'damn :/' ?

I agree

thanks mimu i appreciate you taking the time to write that and keeping it thoughtful and respectful even if you found this disappointing. I am on a soul-searching mission to discover why I am passionate about generative AI where others aren't. Your point about the AI song at the end of the Patterns 5++ preview is potent; because I spent hundreds of hours on it. When I generated that track, in all of 30 seconds, my jaw dropped to the floor at the technical capability and it's future potential application. Plus it had contextual relevance to the story I wanted to portray in the video. I don't see generative AI as a cheap shortcut in the sense that you do. With exception, if someone attempted to pass it off as their own work. Using synth pre-sets for a song is possibly closer to how I feel about the concept. The effort, the creative decision making and the final output are things I value, probably in that order. I have been experimenting with synthesized vocals for 4+ years and I'm using AI generated vocals in future songs. I will spend 50+ hours layering my own work on top and I think I'm going to make incredibly exciting and unique content in the process. It will push me creatively further than before. In the same sense learning web development with AI has opened opportunities that would have previously meant investing thousands of hours. I would really appreciate your thoughts on that, maybe it gives you some fresh angles to consider. Life would be boring if everybody had the same feelings 🫡

you know shit's real when mimu of all people comments about it

@@schmutz06 ​ i appreciate your response, and im going to do my best to be as honest as possible i acknowledge and appreciate the amount of time and effort you put into patterns 5++, you can seriously tell how much went into it by the song and video itself. the main reason i am disappointed is because of your use of the generation of "Full" songs, or rather songs that have each instrument, mixing, mastering, etc, generated by AI. i find this to be the cheap shortcut in question, although i would like to know if any extra processing was done to this song and the patterns 5++ ending song after it was generated. while i understand the concept of an AI generated song in a boss battle song against an AI makes sense contextually, if your point was to show the technical capability and potential of AI, then i found that the song did not. compared to the quality of the main song, the quality was lackluster and as i said in my first comment, i felt as if the song didnt have a place in the video. the fact that you claim it was generated in 30 seconds somewhat adds on to my point. i'm sure you can understand how i can see the "cheap shortcut" in this situation. the dissapointment aspect also comes from the fact that you have an insane ability to create astonishing videos and songs, but chose to use a lower quality ai generated song as the outro. in terms of how i perceive generative AI, it mainly is the generation of full songs, even if someone isnt outright claiming it is theirs. my general opinion is that people publicizing AI generated content (and content in general) assume some level of ownership over the piece of content they are publicizing. i do understand your view point on generative AI however, and i am Not wanting to accuse you of attempting to pass it off as your own work, as i know you have no malicious intent and are solely experimenting. when it comes to the comparison of generative AI to synth presets as a tool to assist, i agree with your outlook. but the generation of full songs does not line up with this comparison in my opinion. i personally see synth presets as a way to learn and mainly develop the ability to sound design and to an extent, mixing. i used presets a ton when i first started music and was able to quickly pick up the inner workings of serum, and other plugins like phase plant and vital (along with a few youtube tutorials of course lol). in my opinion, generative AI lacks the ability to provide these skills when generating whole songs. as i stated in my first comment however, many tools such as the one i named, synplant 2, use generative AI in a way in which it furthers the sound design, and to an extent, compositional abilities of the user. synthesized vocals and AI generated vocals, for the purposes in which you are currently using them for, are more than fine. as you are integrating them into your workflow, and creating something new and exciting with them. although i personally was not a fan of the way the synthesized vocals in the original patterns 5 were mixed, the vocals in patterns 5++ were a big improvement and i could very much tell that alot of effort was put into them. when you say AI helped with learning web development, as someone who is studying cyber security and as someone who considers themselves to be semi proficient in web development and javascript, i find that AI is helpful for the automation aspect of things. i also find that with AI, if i have an idea that i do want to come into fruition (let's just say i wanted to do an AJAX request in jQuery, but didnt know how to exactly type it out) i use it to cut the time it would take for me writing out said ajax request, and ensure that the code produced by whichever AI tool i was using is secure. there have been many cases in which AI has generated insecure code for both me and other people. while this (arxiv.org/pdf/2211.03622.pdf ) study by members of stanford university is not solely based around web development, they concluded that people with generative AI coding tools more likely than not produce insecure code. this, for me, would be a deterrent if i am to Learn something such as web development, as the repercussions of insecure code can be catastrophic. that being said, i hope you found this response interesting, thanks for being with the community for so long! for as long as i've been in the community you've always been an inspiration of mine with the nuts sound design you produce

​@ thanks for taking the time to write that! much respect. I understand your point regarding the generation of full songs by AI, and I understand the concerns about it being a ‘shortcut’. It’s a valid perspective, considering the incredible effort that goes into production. However, my view is that even if an AI generates a track in 30 seconds, the creativity comes into play with what I choose to do with it. That’s where my role as the artist comes in, to take that output and make it part of something bigger to portray the idea. There's still going to be an effort behind integrating these elements seamlessly. Your experience with presets echoes it. They're prefab elements that helped you grow, and my view on AI is closer to that than a cheap trick. I don't see it as the composer, more like an advanced instrument and how we conduct it to make something resonant. I don't believe that non-musicians will generate the same quality output as those experienced at creating music. Fully synthesized audio can serve as a component. It does not need to be the centrepiece and I don't think it is in this video. It can be a means to an end, complimenting and accelerating an idea. I made a song about my strumbar switches failing in my gameplay video ua-cam.com/video/e3a75NW53XU/v-deo.html I think it worked fine, and only added creatively. There was no post processing applied in this or the P5++ outro song. But yes, in Patterns 5++, that voice was indeed heavily modified, over the course of years. For the 'lyrics' and narrative, I was inspired by GLaDOs in portal. With future tracks, I feel excited to be able to add bespoke professional sounding vocals. I will use vocals in very unique ways. For code, like you, it's getting to the right syntax quicker which has been the game changer. Figuring out there was one too many brackets or a semi colon in the wrong place has quite literally transformed from an afternoon, to a 5 second fix. And I don't believe that I am impacting my fundamental understanding or lacking vigilance when it comes to security either. I care a lot about being able to understand everything it is doing. Thanks for your inputs, your expertise and general passion helps me understand the other perspective better.

Thanks. The lyrics (also AI) are quite ridiculous and the singing reminds me of the most unsettling early 2000s educational video style, which is what I wanted to try to make this satire

'This ain't it' is pretty concise feedback. If you have a moment, I'd love to know specifically what didn't resonate. It helps to understand different viewpoints.

@schmutz06 using ai to make music is kinda low considering you made some solid stuff before without it but do what you will

​@@qiukcshro I will. It's intriguing to explore what constitutes effort in digital productions. I have freely used synth presets and memes. Where do you draw your line? AI can streamline processes like a turbo charger for getting ideas from the mind to a finished product, but it's the human touch that shapes the end result. Would you consider that blending AI with creativity might be the next step in the evolution of music production and consumption? Can you think beyond the idea of AI as an 'easy out', OR do you think it means little Timmy can press a big button and compete with the modern day Mozart? Because I don't think it does. I think the musically gifted and those who put in real work will retain all the edge they have. I'm struggling to understand the strong repulsion. It only seems like a preconceived, knee-jerk response.

@@schmutz06 it just doesnt sound good idk what you want me to say really

what's missing in your view?

gta 4

@@kattny ☝🤓

I expected this response from some (maybe many). Can you check out the description and share your thoughts?

@@schmutz06 it just feels kinda insensitive to "make" an ai song especially about something as serious as a bombing, that combined with the morally questionable ai is just kinda weird.

and the worst part of all, the song sucks lol

​@@kattny ok thanks for that. I will try to articulate my thoughts. I use humour during hard times, it's a relief from the tension. I understand why that characteristic could be seen as distasteful, or weird and I'm conscious of it. I grew up watching shows like the Simpsons and South Park and the boundary between edgy satire and 'distasteful' is different for everyone. I decided to post this and try to open up some discussion on it. The AI is something I've been exploring creatively. The debate about the human data it's trained on and whether it will diminish / cannibalise the value of original artistry is a big deal. My ability to create puts food on the table and I could be the most ignorant pro-AI person. The creative process for me is usually combining whatever resources I can into something new. That seems to be what stimulates me and might be why I am at odds with people on AI. I'm thinking hard and often about it. Final two things, I think most flaws are mild and should be tolerated. And secondly; it is impossible to make content that everybody likes; aiming to do that will break anyone (I tortured myself over whether to publish this and your initial comment was my worst nightmare, but it's good to talk and I appreciate your follow up). Taking those two things into account online can go a long way to keeping sane online, in my opinion.

@@schmutz06 thanks for your reply, i appreciate this response honestly as it makes a bit more sense in my brain, still dont agree with it but it could be much worse ig, have a good night

it actually does. My attention to detail is insane most of the time. Well actually it did, but for some reason I noticed it had 10017 in the download. But when I upload the chart solo outside of the pack, it will be the 9999 version. Also, I'd have featured a note streak in the video but the bot could not FC it. The 1664nps zigzag quints break it.

@schmutz06 neat! Hopefully next April fools, we get patterns 99999+

When you say "easter eggs", what do you mean?

@@antoinehcudyd182 in this sense easter eggs are jokes or references that get put into stuff like games and films. I usually end up adding them to a lot of my stuff. It's fun when people find them after years going undiscovered

​@@schmutz06OK 😶

​@@schmutz06I will never find. My film culture is rather limited.

​@@schmutz06 I know I ask a lot of questions, but that's because I rarely get to talk to my favorite artists, sorry. Why aren't you on Spotify.

Rip hands